If you want people in your Church to be your friends, do stuff out side of organised church events with them....
do coffee, movies… sport… bush walking… dinner… bbq’s… you could try just watching telly with them on a week night if thats your bag… but you can do just about anything you might do with your Non-Christian Friends (within reason folks)
time together particully outside the confines of organised church activities… is what will build your friendships… and the more you can suffer and strive together and overcome and encourage each the closer you will become… Try team sports with your church.
Im sorry to say… Bible Study groups DO NOT build friendships… although they may introduce you to friends. If all you do is church and bible study or even bible study socials you never actually made a friend just an associate.... oh you can argue but when you realise its true you’ll wish you learnt earlier and didnt waste your life on a shadow.
Think about the 2 or 3 really close friends in your life? do/did you see them outside of “Church” Activity… of course you do/did.
Tell me Im right people?
Jeff to me bible study is what seperates, my aquiantances at church who i talk to after the service from my true encouragers in christ. For me trime which I spend outside of church, with other christians, outside of the context of a bible study, while helping to build up friendships in christ, usually never has anything to do with tallking about the bible, encourgaing one and other, and praying for one and other. Bible study gourps (which at my chiurch meet once every week) are a time where all we do is focis on the bible, learning from it, praying for one and other, and talking about how were faring in christ...Yes time outside bible study groups with your christian friends is important, but to me my most important, and best christian friends are the ones who really encourage me in christ, and to me the greatest time when im encourged by others in christ, is during bible study....as such I fiund that my closest christian friends are my bible study friends...but i will agree, it isn’t just engouh to have regimented time of just studying, hang out time is also ccritical to our friendships....but contrary to your question Jeff...i find that my best friends are the friendships which have developed from my bible study group over the past 3 years.
I can see where Jeffro is coming from, I can also see where every one else is coming from as well and i think there is much merit on both sides.
I have been invovled in Bible studies where the only conversation is about the text being studied and not much more, there has been no actual real sharing going on of individual lives. I once said to this group that I was struggling in a certain area and all they did was to quote scripture at me - no one and there was about 8 of us in that group offered to help me in the way that I needed help - they were just being religious thats all.
I think this type of group is the type of group Jeffro is talking about.
I am glad to say though Jeffro that I also am part of a great group of men where we do discuss the scriptures, we do pray for oneanother and we do help each other out as needed and the more we pray together, the more we work together the deeper the friendship grows. It is interesting that this group of guys I meet with are mostly older than what I am - that doesn’t matter. I also have some great friendships with some people I rarely meet - however we often encourage one another and pray for one another and share with one another about the real issues in our lives which is much needed.
I think that the older one gets, the more sedate ones life gets, When I was younger and a boozer, it was of to the pub, off to the nightclub, of to a party, chase girls, get drunk, get slapped perhaps - it was though a very shallow time in my life -
I must say that being a Christian has been the best thing that ever happened to me, my friendships are better and my life is not so shallow.
I think what made my bible study group so helpful for me, was that there were people there who really were enthusiastic to get into gods word and learn from it...and when you had problems, yes they did give you scripture to learn and grow from...but isn’t that one of the uses of the bible, as described by the bible..."the word is useful for TEACHING, REBUKING, and TRAINING IN RIGHTEOUSNESS” ? As such I felt encourgaed forward in christ...because my eyes had been opened as to what I was doing wrong, and what I should be doing...But more importnantl;y, having people there who were praying for you, and who were willing to discuss their christian life, and help others, as well as giving you advice....
I’ve been offline for most of the last two weeks (oh, the horror!) and I haven’t yet caught up with all the posts here. I’ll contribute more fully once I’ve had a chance to read through everything and mull it over, but in the meantime I present this:
Jeff, I agree the word friend is something that is splashed around somewhat carelessly and meaninglessly, and I see Aquiaintances as being people you have met, a few times, talked to and like...Friends as being people who you share your lives experiences with, who you talk to frquently, and reveal your inner self to...I see brothers and sisters in christ as being as term whcih correctly links all believers together as being gods adopted children...Hence by the way your friend was talking about his friends...I would identifyt them as being an aquaintance, someone to me who is an aquaintance, is someone who you talk to but never reveal any of your deeper private self to, and the more of yourself you reveal to one particular person defines the strength of that friendship...Allow me to introduce another term: christian friend, whcih i will talk about later
I think you are kind of misunderstanding me Jeffro...i see that this is topic at which tyou feel quite passionate about, I am not suggesting that friendship can develop without activities outside of bible studies, since i have spent more time outside of bible study with these people the friendships have grown...However let me now bring in this term christian friend… A christian friend isn’t someone who like you is a chrisitan, and you spend time with having fun...A christian friend is someone who encourages and leads you forward in christ, and is someoine who prays for you and you pray for...To me this is where bible study comes in...If you just spend time with someone who is a christian having fun, but never really encourage each other by talking about your chrisitan life, the bible or anything, which I notice is something which we are very prone to doing whilst meeting outside of bible study, then is that friend any more than a friend who isn’t a christian, if they are not indeed discussing the bible...?
This is where bible study fits in, its fomral time which is completely dedacated to growing in christ, and encouraging one and other, and praying...It also, provides an environment in which friefndships which encourage christian encouragement, are built. Thus for me bible study distinguishes christians who are my friends from christian friendships...However I do agree that time spent outside of the bible study itself is critical for the christian friendships to develop into close friendships…
On Mike Jeffrey’s programme on 702 yesterday, the “Mid-Week” conference segment was about Sydney and its “friendliness”: how easy is to make friends if you move here, or move suburbs within Sydney?
I think the psychologist must have read a book by our own Jason Poulos, as she basically said exactly what he wrote!
Suggestions given to solve the issue of not having friends as such were to be the first to make the move, not hang around waiting for invites—be the first!
Sorry to tangent this, but I wondered what you guys thought about this…
I felt more than a bit uncomfortable tonight when I was one of only a few people left in the train on the way home and glanced up from my book (I was facing half the seats in the carriage) to see that a random stranger was apparently taking a photo of me with his mobile phone. It seemed to be held in my direction. There was no-one else he could have been pointing it at and it was too far away (and a funny angle) for him to have been watching something.
As soon as I realised, I changed seats and sat the opposite way with my hair hiding my face. The guy got off one or two stops later. I have never seen him before.
I later bumped into Sophie and mentioned it to her. She is under the impression that images are okay but audio cannot be recorded. I don’t know if that’s right (perhaps someone can confirm?), but assuming it is, does it make anyone else feel uncomfortable to think that people could take a picture of them, without asking permission or telling them that they were doing/had done so, nor providing a reason? I don’t like the fact that if he did take a photo of me before I noticed - for any reason - I can’t do anything about it at all. Eek!
Picture phones don’t necessarily perturb me unless they’re being used for acts of perversion or blatant disregard for a person’s emotional and psychological well-being.
I know that a few of the nightclubs in the area are petitioning on banning cellphones that are capable of taking pictures of people.
Due to the high density of patrons per nightclub and that being able to sneak into the opposite sexes’ bathroom is more than simple (unless the bathrooms are located near the entrance/exit way), being able to identify any would-be pervert can be near impossible.
Taking pictures of anyone in a directive manner (i.e: singled out and not within a group field shot) is, as far as I’m concerned, illegal if permission isn’t granted first.
But then again, the loopholes in the law can easily be twisted to state that being out in the open voluntarily places you in a position where you are seen by many and that though you may have had a picture taken of you by use of a cellphone, it is not illegal so long as the image is not distributed or used in an otherwise degrading manner (i.e: posted up on the web or distributed amongst friends).
In some cases taking pictures of people without their expressed permission can have more than moral rammifications set into play, especially in regards to people with visual impairments (photosensitivity, cataracts, corneal tearing, etc,.).
I’m photosensitive myself, and even with dark specs on light bothers me a camera flash renders me temporarily blind and in quite the ammount of agony. And that’s sometimes just only the surface tension. SO I’d be utterly distraught if someone worse off than myself were to sudenly have a camera flash going off only a few feet away from them.
But yes:
I believe taking a picture of someone with a camera that is tiny without their direct, spoken or noted permission is just plain unethical.
I might even say - “Treat them like a laser pointer: dangerous to point and shoot at an unsuspecting person, especially if you’re seen doing it in ways that’ll more than likely have your butt charged and thrown in the clink.”
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