Hi everyone,

Sometime ago I posted a topic on forgiveness and how I would, at times, struggle to forgive an offence done to me. I found the discussion helped me gain a far richer understanding of forgiveness which really helped to transform my thinking, and as a result, me.

Lately I’ve been pondering

1Cor. 15:31 I die every day --I mean that, brothers --just as surely as I glory over you in Christ Jesus our Lord. AND Phil. 1:21 For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain.

I have a number of questions which I hope will generate discussion and help me in my attempt to die to self and ‘live is Christ’.

1.What does it mean:-
1.1 to live is Christ and to die is gain?
1.2 to die each day?

2. How is 1.1 and 1.2 made possible in the life of a believer?

3. I find in a heated discussion I have a tendency to justify myself, to want to be understood and sometimes protect myself/ become self-defensive. Can anyone identify with this? The motives for doing so and the behaviour itself don’t seem to be in agreement with the Scripture I quoted.
I would like to put this part of my nature to death and any discussion would be very much appreciated. Please quote as much scripture as possible as I am in need of biblical surgery.

Please feel free to add any queries of your own on this topic.

I eagerly await your posts
thanks
angela

Just to get things started with a minor issue of interpretation. Lots of deep and meaningful stuff has been written on Paul’s statement in 1Cor 15:31, “I die every day.” I suspect that it probably misses the rather less complex point being made by Paul.

First, translations like the ESV and NASB are a little misleading:
[quote author="1Cor 15:31 (ESV)"]I protest, brothers, by my pride in you, which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die every day!

The portion translated “I die every day” is actually at the beginning of the verse in the Greek, so it sits right next to 1Cor 15:30:
[quote author="1Cor 15:30 (ESV)"]Why am I in danger every hour?

This verse is actually mistranslated in the ESV, because the Greek has a plural, it should read “Why are we in danger every hour?” (I can find no reference to a manuscript with the singular, so I’ve emailed Crossway in the hope that they’ll fix it in a future version.)

Second, the verb ἀποθνῄσκω ‘to die’ need not be understood so precisely. Elsewhere it has slightly broader meanings, and many commentators prefer to understand it here similar to the NET Bible:
[quote author="1Cor 15:31 (NET)"]Every day I am in danger of death! This is as sure as my boasting in you, which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord

This fits with the context (since Paul has just stated that he is in danger every hour, and subsequently identifies a threat to his life in verse 32).

Third, Paul’s language is possible influenced by Psalm 44:22, which says something similar in the plural.

So I would be wary of reading too much into 1Cor 15:31.

But it’s too late to address the rest of your questions (for me, anyway), so over to someone else!

Enkidu,

Thanks so much for clearing up my misunderstanding of 1Cor 15:31, “I die every day.”

If you, along with anyone else, has some helpful insights regarding my first post I would be very grateful.

cheers
angela

Re: to live is Christ and to die is gain

[quote author="Angela Crittle"]Hi everyone,

I have a number of questions which I hope will generate discussion and help me in my attempt to die to self and ‘live is Christ’.

1.What does it mean:-
1.1 to live is Christ and to die is gain?

Hi Angela,
we’ve just been preaching through Phillipians at St Augustine’s Neutral Bay and I had the privilege of addressing this section.

In the context of Phillipians I think we can make the following comments:

i the thrust of Phillipians is confidence in Christ expressed as “boasting/rejoicing”. This confidence is firmly rooted in the all-sufficient work of Christ as stated in chapter 3 (i.e. everything else is rubbish etc.)

ii the confidence brings an expectation of resurrection. Particularly worked out in 2:9; 3:10, 20-21; and implicitly in texts like 1:6.

iii the direct context is one of apparent setback - Paul is imprisoned and has opponents in the church. He may die.

Yet we are lifted out of this short-termism by two strong facts:
a) Christ must be preached - He is everything (e.g. 1:18, 22 fruitful labour)
b) Resurrection awaits us

And so Paul can say - to live is Christ; that is Christ is both the focus/joy/boasting of his life and his work i.e. telling others of Him
- to die is gain; Paul will be raised with Christ.

It’s a powerful statement because it can be said of nothing else.
If to live is my daughter then to die is to lose her. Likewise my marriage, i won’t be married in heaven. Likewise all the things that I have joy in here. They’ll all burn away.

But if my life now is for Christ then to die is only gain because, as someone has already pointed out, what I now only see through a mirror darkly will be all the more revealed to me.

Trusting this makes sense and is edifying.

David[/url]

Angela said:

I find in a heated discussion I have a tendency to justify myself, to want to be understood and sometimes protect myself/ become self-defensive. Can anyone identify with this? The motives for doing so and the behaviour itself don’t seem to be in agreement with the Scripture I quoted.

I’m not a scholar so I’ll keep clear of trying to explain what a confusing passage means.

But I would like to visit the concern of being defensive. Personally, I go to great lengths to avoid heated exchanges because I find if a discussion gets heated I actually find it very difficult to think clearly. And even if I think my point of view is perfectly clear and reasonable, it may not be when I have a chance to reflect later.

Despite that, I don’t think there is anything inherently wrong about wanting to protect and justify oneself. I know I want to be accepted and understood. And sometimes being angry and having a heated discussion may be called for. I am not convinced that emotions that are stirred up in a heated discussion (argument?) are necessarily bad - it’s more how I handle them that is important.

Do I hang onto them, after the sun goes down? Or do I hand them over to God, so to speak, and move on?

On the question of motives, my suspicion is that I’m not the only Christian out there who can be self-centred at times. And being that way is not inherently bad, my mind jumps to the topic elsewhere on Burn out.

For Me to Live is Christ

I say Amen to what Davidould said. It took me a little while to understand the passage, but as time progressed the spirit chose to reveal the great strength of the statement. I find that particualr verse to be one of my favourites, as it just hammers in the great hope we have as christians. “To Die is Gain”, we know we can be accepted into gods kingdom, because of what Jesus did on the cross!!!!!  :D

I have this phrase as my MSN, name, and recently someone who i had never met, who was using a friend of a friends account, just asked me straight up, wha6t does your name mean. From that question i was able to explain the gospel to him, and see his response, even though at the end of the conversation, he said, “yeah i knew that and i agree with it...i was just testing your understanding”, i am convinced that that verse may have had an impact on his life.

On the part for me to live is christ....well i see it as meaning that there is nothing more important in my life than Christ...as Davidould said:

It’s a powerful statement because it can be said of nothing else.
If to live is my daughter then to die is to lose her. Likewise my marriage, i won’t be married in heaven. Likewise all the things that I have joy in here. They’ll all burn away.

Hopefully this discussion has openned your eyes and allowed you to see the beauty of this passage

Your Brother in Christ

Chris