A friend talked to me about the Church Missionary Society the other day. I am a huge fan of these guys because they support so many of my friends, and because their theological priorities seem so right.
But my question is, what makes a good mission society?
My guess would be one that gets a good balance between the five Ps: proclamation, prayer, people, persecution, pragmatism. If any is pushed too far, or neglected, the mission has problems.
Personally, I’m not too keen on CMS. I don’t think sending doctors is where it’s at.
Personally, I’m not too keen on CMS. I don’t think sending doctors is where it’s at.
I don’t really understand what you mean by this. Over the years I’ve prayed for and supported dozens of CMS missionaries in various contexts
7 in Tanzania, 9 in Argentina, 2 in Kenya, 4 in Chile, 6 in Pakistan, 4 in Japan, 9 in France, 4 in Slovenia, 2 in Mexico, 2 in Indonesia, 2 in Russia, 2 in Australia (Arnhem Land), 2 in Spain then Belgium, 3 in Italy—58 in total, not mentioning others I’ve known about through various reports
Of the 58, the only 2 doctors among them that I know—husband and wife—stopped being doctors when they joined CMS. One in order to be a fulltime student worker, and one to be a wife and mother.
So if your concern about CMS is that there are too many doctors, maybe it would be worth considering whether your picture of them is completely true to the facts. I would hate to see the work of any mission organization run down on the basis of rumour or inaccuracy. It would also be unfair to the many who’ve sacrificed so much to work in places we wouldn’t.
It is possible my understanding is wrong, but I don’t think it is. Part of what they do is send people to continue their trained profession in other less fortunate areas and be a Christian presence there, whether they’re doctors or engineers or accountants or teachers or anything. Which is a great thing to do. But it’s not mission.
Dannii, that may well be one of the things they do, but the people I’ve been praying for are doing a lot more than that, including a significant number of them who are full-time gospel workers
And for all the other readers of these posts:
Pray for the CMS Australia staff at GAFCon this week who will be continuing to work on
missionary opportunities among the Anglican Communion around the world, such as
training clergy, supporting local churches and evangelism.
It is possible my understanding is wrong, but I don’t think it is. Part of what they do is send people to continue their trained profession in other less fortunate areas and be a Christian presence there, whether they’re doctors or engineers or accountants or teachers or anything. Which is a great thing to do. But it’s not mission.
This reminds me of a Piper quote, which I’ll do the best to communicate from memory. As you read, imagine a think American accent with lots of passion.
It’s no mistake that in the wake of the modern missionary movement has come churches, hospitals and schools. The reason I think is this; You can’t worship God if you’re dead, and you can’t worship God if you don’t know how to think
.
Thus, I think it is fitting we send teachers and doctors for the reasons above. And also people of other professions who can use them in acts of love and service for people and also get into closed countries.
There’s a spectrum, between those fortunate enough to do full time ministry (though it could never truly be 100% full time), and those with a secular job trying to have a mission based mindset. I don’t know where I’d draw the line of what a mission organisation should be doing, but it worried me when a soon-to-be-CMS-missionary I met said he’d talked to doctors who’d gone with CMS but said they actually had very little time to talk to others about Jesus.
How would I define mission? Probably along the five Ps. If there’s no proclamation it’s not mission. If there’s no prayer it’s not mission. If there’s no focus on people it’s not mission. If you’re not doing anything that could lead to persecution it’s not mission. And if you’re not focusing or focusing too much on pragmatism, well it still might be mission but it wouldn’t be healthy mission.
Ahh Geoff you make a good point I had forgotten. In “creative access” countries, I think the situation is different. My comments above are more for the open countries. But even if you’re in a creative access country, if you’re not getting many opportunities to talk to people about Jesus I would be reluctant to call it mission.
I am part of the group of CMS MiTs (Missionary in Training) who have just finished 5 months at St Andrew’s Hall in Melbourne and are heading out to deputation (back to Sydney tomorrow actually!)
Dannii- I think if CMS is not favorable to you because ‘you don’t think sending doctors is where its at’ - can I give you a few facts.
Gordon is right in the numbers he gives - a quick look through the CMS prayer diary gives a good overview of what CMS missionaries do all over the world.
We have eight people in our group who have just finished. Here is what they are doing:
2 going to Thailand to work at Christ Church Bangkok leading Bible studies with Karen refugees, Prostitutes and expats.
2 going to Germany to be involved in church planting and university ministry.
2 going to a ‘closed’ country to be involved in training pastors.
2 going to Mexico to run an Theological Certificate training program by for pastors throughout Latin America.
Clearly they are all missionaries!
By the way - for what its worth, here are my thoughts on why CMS is such a good Mission society. (In no particular order)
- CMS has its priorities right. Since 1799 when Henry Venn etc formed the society, the gospel and people hearing and responding to the gospel has been the driving force behind the society.
- CMS cares deeply about its missionaries. I have just finished 5 months full time residential training, which followed an extensive interview and selection process. There are very strong pastoral care networks and ‘systems’ in place.
- CMS cares deeply about its members. Because CMS is a society, members are key. Members are kept well informed with relevant and well produced materials for prayer and reading, and are able to participate in brilliant conferences like CMS Summer School - which is without parallel in the world.
- CMS cares deeply about teaching kids to be missionaries. Throughout the year CMS runs camps for kids that not only give the kids a fun experience, but expose them to what God is doing all over the world through his people.
I’m sure there are other things - but I need to get back to packing the house so we can head up the Hume tomorrow.
- CMS has its priorities right. Since 1799 when Henry Venn etc formed the society, the gospel and people hearing and responding to the gospel has been the driving force behind the society.
The one that always strikes me is about money coming in second place, not first. CMS has done a great job of working at this.
I was speaking to an Anglican minister the other day who was singing the praises of CMS, because of the support and training they offer and because—important for a church leader—they do such a good job of responding flexibly to what churches ask of them, in his experience (which was substantial). They are thoughtful about where to place people, but listen carefully to advice they get from sending churches.
Dannii- I think if CMS is not favorable to you because ‘you don’t think sending doctors is where its at’ - can I give you a few facts.
Gordon is right in the numbers he gives - a quick look through the CMS prayer diary gives a good overview of what CMS missionaries do all over the world.
I’m pleased to hear this is what the numbers shows. When CMS has been advertised to me however, there has been a much bigger emphasis on sending doctors and engineers etc etc. It was a sort of “everyone can be involved, whatever your current occupation.” I’d be happy to accept I don’t have a clear picture of CMS, but if I’m honest, the CMS that’s been presented to me hasn’t been the best one.
- CMS cares deeply about teaching kids to be missionaries. Throughout the year CMS runs camps for kids that not only give the kids a fun experience, but expose them to what God is doing all over the world through his people.
Not just the various camps run through the year, but at Summer School in Katoomba each January, my children learn about missionaries where they are at school, as well as hearing about what others are doing in places that some of us would not like to go.
I’m challenged, too! By God, through His word being faithfully taught by the main Bible Study leader, and by the various missionaries sharing their experiences of how God is working through them. Sometimes even as doctors. Shock, horror.
My guess would be one that gets a good balance between the five Ps: proclamation, prayer, people, persecution, pragmatism. If any is pushed too far, or neglected, the mission has problems.
Personally, I’m not too keen on CMS. I don’t think sending doctors is where it’s at.
What missionary organisations are you keen on then? Here are just a few you might have heard of:
Do you think any of the above fit your idea of what is really “mission”?
In light of your comments above, with people being sent out through CMS - they take every opportunity to proclaim the good news of Jesus. Prayer is fundamental too - for us at home and them abroad. People who go are equipped & supported in the work they do - & they care deeply for all the unbelieving people they are sent to work with. As for persecution, of course it happens, it’s part and parcel if you’re sent to places like Afghanistan, Nepal or the Middle East - where some CMS missionaries are located.
No idea what you mean by pragmatism.
As a supporter of CMS, I’d add more to what my fellow CMS members have said, except that I think they’ve done a good enough job of clarifying what CMS is all about, already!
Mr Sholl, and family - welcome, in advance, to Sydney! See you at cathedral soon, hopefully.
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