Craig Schwarze - 28 August 2008 01:38 AM

He spent the final 20 or so minutes presenting the gospel, including a lengthy section on Hell which Gordo would have approved of. ...

Here’s a T-shirt that both Gordon and Dave L. could wear :

hell t-shirt

re: talking about hell, I was intrigued that Mark left his description of hell in the sphere of “God loves you too much to send you to heaven”, rather than including some aspect of holiness &/or judgment in his description as well. 

I totally concur with the idea that God is all-loving, but I wonder if this gives us a monochromatic view of the cross (where Jesus demonstrated his love by being judged in our place), rather than one that includes judgment and justice as well as love.

Hi All

On Country Jesus, I thought Driscoll’s critique was of the perception that city-dwellers may have that Jesus is for those religious country folk who aren’t quite as sophisticated as we are.  I don’t think he made the point as well as he might, but I think it was nevertheless a legitimate one.

On Aussie Jesus, I agree that this was the weakest point in the 51 minute “introduction” - very funny, and probably a truth about a particular view of Jesus hidden in there, but it missed me, and everyone I’ve spoken to about it since.

On expository v topical preaching, I think that for the kind of occasion it was, a topical message was entirely appropriate.  This was not offered as a regular preaching diet, but a special moment to hammer home a particular point.  On balance, I was impressed by Mark’s efforts to understand Sydney culture (even if he did make some mistakes), his outstanding gifts as a communicator, and his passion for the Jesus revealed to us in the pages of the Bible, and the message he proclaimed.

I do have some criticisms - of the event, more than the talk.  But I’m not sure that I’m ready to stick my head up into this dense cloud of euphoria - I fear I may be asphyxiated.  Might come back on it later when I’ve strengthened the weak knees.

Bob

Bob Cameron - 30 August 2008 02:58 AM

I do have some criticisms - of the event, more than the talk.  But I’m not sure that I’m ready to stick my head up into this dense cloud of euphoria - I fear I may be asphyxiated.  Might come back on it later when I’ve strengthened the weak knees.

Bob

A new concept deserves a new ‘word for the day’, so in that case you may be suffering from :

Pnigophobia or Pnigerophobia- Fear of choking, of being smothered.

Just had to share that with you Bob - have a great weekend - and enjoy the fresh Sydney air - cheers.

Pnigophobia or Pnigerophobia- Fear of choking, of being smothered.

There was a young man from Australia
Who suffered from pnigerophobia.
A neck tie a no-no,
even shirts just a so-so,
but kissing was strangely a go-go.

Bob Cameron - 30 August 2008 02:58 AM

I do have some criticisms - of the event, more than the talk.  But I’m not sure that I’m ready to stick my head up into this dense cloud of euphoria - I fear I may be asphyxiated.  Might come back on it later when I’ve strengthened the weak knees.

Bob

i had some criticisms of him last week and got shot down. but on the good side Sydneyanglicans like someone who did not go to Moore the last time that happen a young Bradman was practiced alone with a cricket stump and a golf ball

I think they’re also quite keen on Don Carson.

I attended this event with my sister who is a believer in prosperity gospel, and I cringed when Driscoll was making criticisms under the heading Bling Jesus. I thought my sister would want to hit me over the head with her Bible for dragging her along to hear such and offensive individual speak. She thought he was great, really funny and easy to listen to. While it was suprising how long he spoke for, he had an ability to people’s attention.

Just some comments....

1. I could not connect where the Bible passage that was published in the notebook given to everyone fitted into the talke. I could not see the relation between the talk and the passage.

2. He appeared to spend more time talking about what Jesus wasn’t and rather who he is.

3. I couldn’t figure out why they had to sing afterwards. I saw alot of people leaving during that time so it wasn’t a big attraction.

4. The best thing was Driscolll’s call to the apathetic and lazy types. Usually such events are only for the people who have only been involved heavily in ministry or non-christians.

He appeared to spend more time talking about what Jesus wasn’t and rather who he is.

Hi Bronwyn

Your comment reminds me of God’s words to Jeremiah, which I’ve just begun to read again:

Jeremiah 1:9-10 Then Yahweh stretched out his hand and touched my mouth, and Yahweh said to me: ‘There! I have put my words into your mouth.  10 Look, today I have set you over the nations and kingdoms, to uproot and to knock down, to destroy and to overthrow, to build and to plant.’ New Jerusalem Bible

If Mark is a modern day Jeremiah, he might have to spend quite a bit of time uprooting, knocking down, destroying and overthrowing wrong ideas about Jesus, before he can build and plant the correct ideas.

MP3 now available at the KCC shop:

http://shop.kcc.org.au/cubecart/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1602

Bronwyn i think you made some good pts

I really think that they should have been selling those red BYPJ t-shirts to all and sundry. What a great presentation they made - a very professional look indeed.

Andrew Underwood - 31 August 2008 10:24 AM

Bob Cameron - 30 August 2008 02:58 AM

I do have some criticisms - of the event, more than the talk.  But I’m not sure that I’m ready to stick my head up into this dense cloud of euphoria - I fear I may be asphyxiated.  Might come back on it later when I’ve strengthened the weak knees.

Bob

I had some criticisms of him last week and got shot down.

Andrew
I believe that I was one of the ‘shooters’!  For the record, I have no problem with you or anyone critically engaging with Driscoll or any other preacher.  What I objected to on that occasion was the manner of the criticism.  [For those who are interested, have a look here.)
Bob

David McKay - 31 August 2008 04:17 PM

He appeared to spend more time talking about what Jesus wasn’t and rather who he is.

Hi Bronwyn

Your comment reminds me of God’s words to Jeremiah, which I’ve just begun to read again:

Jeremiah 1:9-10 Then Yahweh stretched out his hand and touched my mouth, and Yahweh said to me: ‘There! I have put my words into your mouth.  10 Look, today I have set you over the nations and kingdoms, to uproot and to knock down, to destroy and to overthrow, to build and to plant.’ New Jerusalem Bible

If Mark is a modern day Jeremiah, he might have to spend quite a bit of time uprooting, knocking down, destroying and overthrowing wrong ideas about Jesus, before he can build and plant the correct ideas.

I don’t believe what you are saying is appropriate considering it was a one-off event. Driscoll won’t have the opportunity to build a relationship with most of the crowd in the Sydney Entertainment centre.  In fact he will probably never be in the same room again with most of the audience for that evening. Building the right ideas in the minds of those who need it will be left to the pastoral staff of local churches IF they get the opportunity.

Mark Driscoll gave a very inspiring and workmanlike presentation of God’s love for us, but I believe it is time for a change. Time to evolve the Christian message. The appeal of the traditional preacher seems to be for those weighed down by ignorance and guilt.
They are not so numerous anymore.
In short, I feel the way forward , even if it is an anathema to many Christians, is a merger between science and faith. We cannot , I believe , second guess God and expect Jesus to return and save this imperilled and troubled planet. We should use the unique brains and genes that God created for us.